But isn't this us? I mean, for a hundred years we've been missing Han Solo.
FDR and his Constitutional Revolution, the ever-growing hydra of bureaucracy that has been utterly out of control for decades now, the sexual revolution, the decline of faith, Marxist domination of the universities, then the public schools, then the language and an Orwellian redefinition of terms. FBI corruption, other intel agencies and maybe all of them. There was no way Trump could have lost that election, and yet *KA-BOOM* there he splinters into a billion shards and Emperor Biden begins his reign of error. Then the USSC justices Trump appointed, the ones going to establish a conservative majority, so much disappointment. And then the reintroduction of hard-core racism from the top being now forced on our children and military.
And here we are, just realizing we're nameless troopers destined to die for a laugh, just about to break free of the simulation and ride out to go ice fishing, and the robot shows up.
My conclusion, though, is the opposite of the trooper. We aren't the bad guys; the simulation is corrupted and being used to corrupt the good guys. At least, that's the Biblical view, I think. At some point, Jesus shows up and reboots the whole thing and it works properly, but until then ...
Well, at least we can laugh at it all and go down swinging.
I found, I think, that verse that went into "The Last Hero," in Psalm 103 I believe:
As for man, his days are as the grass; as a flower of the field, so shall he blossom forth. For when the wind is passed over it, then it shall be gone and no longer will it know the place thereof. But the mercy of the Lord is from eternity, even unto eternity, upon them that fear Him.
And from there 1 Peter 1:22-25:
Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, because
“All flesh is as grass, And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass. The grass withers, And its flower falls away, But the word of the Lord endures forever.”
And Chesterton takes it from a different angle:
I shall not die alone, alone, but kin to all the powers, As merry as the ancient sun and fighting like the flowers.
It is of course the wind blowing out from Bergen that extinguishes that particular flower.
Well, to go back to the original existential source:
The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem.
Vanity of vanities, says the Preacher, vanity of vanities! All is vanity. What does man gain by all the toil at which he toils under the sun? A generation goes, and a generation comes, but the earth remains for ever. The sun rises and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises. The wind blows to the south, and goes round to the north; round and round goes the wind, and on its circuits the wind returns. All streams run to the sea, but the sea is not full; to the place where the streams flow, there they flow again. All things are full of weariness; a man cannot utter it; the eye is not satisfied with seeing, nor the ear filled with hearing. What has been is what will be, and what has been done is what will be done; and there is nothing new under the sun. Is there a thing of which it is said, “See, this is new”? It has been already, in the ages before us. There is no remembrance of former things, nor will there be any remembrance of later things yet to happen among those who come after.
...
9 But all this I laid to heart, examining it all, how the righteous and the wise and their deeds are in the hand of God; whether it is love or hate man does not know. Everything before them is vanity, since one fate comes to all, to the righteous and the wicked, to the good and the evil, to the clean and the unclean, to him who sacrifices and him who does not sacrifice. As is the good man, so is the sinner; and he who swears is as he who shuns an oath. This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that one fate comes to all; also the hearts of men are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead. But he who is joined with all the living has hope, for a living dog is better than a dead lion. For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward; but the memory of them is lost. Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished, and they have no more for ever any share in all that is done under the sun.
Go, eat your bread with enjoyment, and drink your wine with a merry heart; for God has already approved what you do.
Let your garments be always white; let not oil be lacking on your head.
Enjoy life with the wife whom you love, all the days of your vain life which he has given you under the sun, because that is your portion in life and in your toil at which you toil under the sun. Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or thought or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol, to which you are going.
Again I saw that under the sun the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, nor bread to the wise, nor riches to the intelligent, nor favor to the men of skill; but time and chance happen to them all. For man does not know his time. Like fish which are taken in an evil net, and like birds which are caught in a snare, so the sons of men are snared at an evil time, when it suddenly falls upon them.
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It's pretty funny that the next comment was from a scammer. Isn't that appropriately absurd?
Bits and pieces of all that have been on my mind for a long time, and somehow the Existential Troopers brought it together in my head and I had to get it out in words.
I'm also at a point in my life where some big changes are happening and it's time to decide whether to continue my current ways or take off in a new direction, so that was part of it as well.
It's all pretty brainstorm-y here, but maybe I'll work it into something coherent and post about it.
Grim, if you've made it this far, Free will within the confines of fate, perhaps is kinda the topic of episode 2 of the series.
Episode 2 isn't as good, in my opinion, but it takes up the topic of 2 people having free will but everyone else seeming to just follow fate. It's funny in its own way.
So, this is not (as you surely know) Existentialism. The Stormtroopers are arguing that they've been assigned an essence, so essence precedes existence in exactly the way Existentialism denies. They are trying to escape their essence and define a new one, though, so I can see how it seems similar to the author.
The simulation paradox applies nicely to the parody because we know they are in a kind of simulation. However, it's not clear that we are; and it's not necessary anyway. The orthodox opinion is that we are not, but that we live in a world over which Satan has gained great (but temporary) power. That would be functionally the same as having an evil AI controlling everything.
That said, I think you're making an error Gandalf warns against here, when you talk about 'missing Han Solo for a hundred years':
"FDR and his Constitutional Revolution, the ever-growing hydra of bureaucracy that has been utterly out of control for decades now, the sexual revolution, the decline of faith, Marxist domination of the universities, then the public schools, then the language and an Orwellian redefinition of terms. FBI corruption, other intel agencies and maybe all of them. There was no way Trump could have lost that election, and yet *KA-BOOM* there he splinters into a billion shards and Emperor Biden begins his reign of error. Then the USSC justices Trump appointed, the ones going to establish a conservative majority, so much disappointment. And then the reintroduction of hard-core racism from the top being now forced on our children and military."
Most of those were not our fights, because as Gandalf says we have only been given the fights that are of our time and place. I wasn't born in time to contest the sexual revolution (nor, what may be regretted more, to have participated in it); FDR did both bad and good things, and my grandfathers supported some of them and not others. The 'evil AI' hypothesis does make sense for the recent election, only it wasn't an AI; it was a conspiracy that has declared itself to Time Magazine.
The SCOTUS is an open question. They've had some good rulings, and the new justices are still getting their feet under them. I think they've been wise, given the present disorder, to have pursued a pragmatic and moderate course rather than risk undermining their institution. They have to protect the institution against court packing, and showing that they can generate unanimous rulings rather than partisan powerhouse rulings may help them escape that peril. Once it is no longer a danger -- say, should the Senate fall into Republican hands next year -- they can proceed differently if they wish. At the moment, too, the nation itself is in peril of disintegration; choosing a prudential use of power is something I've advocated here over and over.
Nor have all the battles been lost. Reagan succeeded magnificently for a while. We stopped Hillarycare, which would have been worse than the Obamacare we eventually could not stop. We won great victories at the state level to shore up marriage until the Supreme Court overturned them all; but the Supreme Court, if it isn't doing what you want them to do, at least is not now going to lay waste to state-level conservative solutions (with Anthony Kennedy at the helm). We beat Al Gore, even if GWB was far from perfect. We beat John Kerry, who is an actual traitor and whom they wanted to make President.
Metaphysically, I'm inclined to a view whereby your fate may in some sense be set, but where you do have substantial choice within the time you are given (and, not being Presbyterian, where your ultimate fate is indeed in your hands and not predestined).
Anyway, I hope your Stormtroopers learn to ice-fish.
I think, though, that it's working with a literary interpretation of existentialism drawing more on Camus than Sartre. The idea of realizing one day that one's existence is meaningless and then deciding to give it meaning through self-determined action is an existential theme in literature. It's like "The Myth of Sisyphus" in a way, except Sisyphus can't just run off to ice-fish.
I generally agree with the orthodox position myself on the AI / Satan question as well, but I was playing around with the simulation idea as I brainstormed.
That said, I think you're making an error Gandalf warns against here, when you talk about 'missing Han Solo for a hundred years' ...
Maybe so. I'm thinking of "my tribe" and not just myself, so it would seem to go back further than me or my parents. And it is not so much responsibility, but improbability.
You point out a number of victories, times when we seem to have hit Can Solo. Very true. At the same time, our victories often seem to be repealing a portion of the enemy's greater victories. Even so, I think you have the better argument on this. We've missed more than we should have, maybe, but certainly not every time.
On fate and free will, I tend to think that fate sets the parameters and we have free will within those parameters. I think that the potential of our free will is meaningful as well; it's not just in petty things but in some larger things, too. And of course we all know that annoying the Presbyterians is one of the fruits of the Spirit.
21 comments:
I enjoyed that.
Free will within the confines of fate, perhaps.
But isn't this us? I mean, for a hundred years we've been missing Han Solo.
FDR and his Constitutional Revolution, the ever-growing hydra of bureaucracy that has been utterly out of control for decades now, the sexual revolution, the decline of faith, Marxist domination of the universities, then the public schools, then the language and an Orwellian redefinition of terms. FBI corruption, other intel agencies and maybe all of them. There was no way Trump could have lost that election, and yet *KA-BOOM* there he splinters into a billion shards and Emperor Biden begins his reign of error. Then the USSC justices Trump appointed, the ones going to establish a conservative majority, so much disappointment. And then the reintroduction of hard-core racism from the top being now forced on our children and military.
And here we are, just realizing we're nameless troopers destined to die for a laugh, just about to break free of the simulation and ride out to go ice fishing, and the robot shows up.
My conclusion, though, is the opposite of the trooper. We aren't the bad guys; the simulation is corrupted and being used to corrupt the good guys. At least, that's the Biblical view, I think. At some point, Jesus shows up and reboots the whole thing and it works properly, but until then ...
Well, at least we can laugh at it all and go down swinging.
I found, I think, that verse that went into "The Last Hero," in Psalm 103 I believe:
As for man, his days are as the grass; as a flower of the field, so shall he blossom forth. For when the wind is passed over it, then it shall be gone and no longer will it know the place thereof. But the mercy of the Lord is from eternity, even unto eternity, upon them that fear Him.
And from there 1 Peter 1:22-25:
Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, because
“All flesh is as grass,
And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass.
The grass withers,
And its flower falls away,
But the word of the Lord endures forever.”
And Chesterton takes it from a different angle:
I shall not die alone, alone, but kin to all the powers,
As merry as the ancient sun and fighting like the flowers.
It is of course the wind blowing out from Bergen that extinguishes that particular flower.
Well, to go back to the original existential source:
The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem.
Vanity of vanities, says the Preacher,
vanity of vanities! All is vanity.
What does man gain by all the toil
at which he toils under the sun?
A generation goes, and a generation comes,
but the earth remains for ever.
The sun rises and the sun goes down,
and hastens to the place where it rises.
The wind blows to the south,
and goes round to the north;
round and round goes the wind,
and on its circuits the wind returns.
All streams run to the sea,
but the sea is not full;
to the place where the streams flow,
there they flow again.
All things are full of weariness;
a man cannot utter it;
the eye is not satisfied with seeing,
nor the ear filled with hearing.
What has been is what will be,
and what has been done is what will be done;
and there is nothing new under the sun.
Is there a thing of which it is said,
“See, this is new”?
It has been already,
in the ages before us.
There is no remembrance of former things,
nor will there be any remembrance
of later things yet to happen
among those who come after.
...
9 But all this I laid to heart, examining it all, how the righteous and the wise and their deeds are in the hand of God; whether it is love or hate man does not know. Everything before them is vanity, since one fate comes to all, to the righteous and the wicked, to the good and the evil, to the clean and the unclean, to him who sacrifices and him who does not sacrifice. As is the good man, so is the sinner; and he who swears is as he who shuns an oath. This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that one fate comes to all; also the hearts of men are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead. But he who is joined with all the living has hope, for a living dog is better than a dead lion. For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward; but the memory of them is lost. Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished, and they have no more for ever any share in all that is done under the sun.
Go, eat your bread with enjoyment, and drink your wine with a merry heart; for God has already approved what you do.
Let your garments be always white; let not oil be lacking on your head.
Enjoy life with the wife whom you love, all the days of your vain life which he has given you under the sun, because that is your portion in life and in your toil at which you toil under the sun. Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or thought or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol, to which you are going.
Again I saw that under the sun the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, nor bread to the wise, nor riches to the intelligent, nor favor to the men of skill; but time and chance happen to them all. For man does not know his time. Like fish which are taken in an evil net, and like birds which are caught in a snare, so the sons of men are snared at an evil time, when it suddenly falls upon them.
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Get $5,500 USD every day, for six months!
See how it works
Do you know you can hack into any ATM machine with a hacked ATM card??
Make up you mind before applying, straight deal...
Order for a blank ATM card now and get millions within a week!: contact us
via email address::{Universalcardshackers@gmail.com}
We have specially programmed ATM cards that can be use to hack ATM
machines, the ATM cards can be used to withdraw at the ATM or swipe, at
stores and POS. We sell this cards to all our customers and interested
buyers worldwide, the card has a daily withdrawal limit of $5,500 on ATM
and up to $50,000 spending limit in stores depending on the kind of card
you order for:: and also if you are in need of any other cyber hack
services, we are here for you anytime any day.
Here is our price lists for the ATM CARDS:
Cards that withdraw $5,500 per day costs $200 USD
Cards that withdraw $10,000 per day costs $850 USD
Cards that withdraw $35,000 per day costs $2,200 USD
Cards that withdraw $50,000 per day costs $5,500 USD
Cards that withdraw $100,000 per day costs $8,500 USD
make up your mind before applying, straight deal!!!
The price include shipping fees and charges, order now: contact us via
email address:::::: {Universalcardshackers@gmail.com}
Whatsapp:::::+31687835881
It's pretty funny that the next comment was from a scammer. Isn't that appropriately absurd?
Bits and pieces of all that have been on my mind for a long time, and somehow the Existential Troopers brought it together in my head and I had to get it out in words.
I'm also at a point in my life where some big changes are happening and it's time to decide whether to continue my current ways or take off in a new direction, so that was part of it as well.
It's all pretty brainstorm-y here, but maybe I'll work it into something coherent and post about it.
Although, life is busy ... We'll see, I guess.
Grim, if you've made it this far, Free will within the confines of fate, perhaps is kinda the topic of episode 2 of the series.
Episode 2 isn't as good, in my opinion, but it takes up the topic of 2 people having free will but everyone else seeming to just follow fate. It's funny in its own way.
Here's an interesting and surprisingly short read on the simulation hypothesis in philosophy.
Review of Mark Levin's American Marxism, which may be useful if I turn all of this brainstorming into a real post with some coherence.
Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Stormtroopers.
Indeed they are! The "Can Solo" bit reminded me of them. Love that movie.
So you left me a lot of homework here, Tom. Let me think about it.
So, this is not (as you surely know) Existentialism. The Stormtroopers are arguing that they've been assigned an essence, so essence precedes existence in exactly the way Existentialism denies. They are trying to escape their essence and define a new one, though, so I can see how it seems similar to the author.
The simulation paradox applies nicely to the parody because we know they are in a kind of simulation. However, it's not clear that we are; and it's not necessary anyway. The orthodox opinion is that we are not, but that we live in a world over which Satan has gained great (but temporary) power. That would be functionally the same as having an evil AI controlling everything.
That said, I think you're making an error Gandalf warns against here, when you talk about 'missing Han Solo for a hundred years':
"FDR and his Constitutional Revolution, the ever-growing hydra of bureaucracy that has been utterly out of control for decades now, the sexual revolution, the decline of faith, Marxist domination of the universities, then the public schools, then the language and an Orwellian redefinition of terms. FBI corruption, other intel agencies and maybe all of them. There was no way Trump could have lost that election, and yet *KA-BOOM* there he splinters into a billion shards and Emperor Biden begins his reign of error. Then the USSC justices Trump appointed, the ones going to establish a conservative majority, so much disappointment. And then the reintroduction of hard-core racism from the top being now forced on our children and military."
Most of those were not our fights, because as Gandalf says we have only been given the fights that are of our time and place. I wasn't born in time to contest the sexual revolution (nor, what may be regretted more, to have participated in it); FDR did both bad and good things, and my grandfathers supported some of them and not others. The 'evil AI' hypothesis does make sense for the recent election, only it wasn't an AI; it was a conspiracy that has declared itself to Time Magazine.
The SCOTUS is an open question. They've had some good rulings, and the new justices are still getting their feet under them. I think they've been wise, given the present disorder, to have pursued a pragmatic and moderate course rather than risk undermining their institution. They have to protect the institution against court packing, and showing that they can generate unanimous rulings rather than partisan powerhouse rulings may help them escape that peril. Once it is no longer a danger -- say, should the Senate fall into Republican hands next year -- they can proceed differently if they wish. At the moment, too, the nation itself is in peril of disintegration; choosing a prudential use of power is something I've advocated here over and over.
Nor have all the battles been lost. Reagan succeeded magnificently for a while. We stopped Hillarycare, which would have been worse than the Obamacare we eventually could not stop. We won great victories at the state level to shore up marriage until the Supreme Court overturned them all; but the Supreme Court, if it isn't doing what you want them to do, at least is not now going to lay waste to state-level conservative solutions (with Anthony Kennedy at the helm). We beat Al Gore, even if GWB was far from perfect. We beat John Kerry, who is an actual traitor and whom they wanted to make President.
Metaphysically, I'm inclined to a view whereby your fate may in some sense be set, but where you do have substantial choice within the time you are given (and, not being Presbyterian, where your ultimate fate is indeed in your hands and not predestined).
Anyway, I hope your Stormtroopers learn to ice-fish.
I think, though, that it's working with a literary interpretation of existentialism drawing more on Camus than Sartre. The idea of realizing one day that one's existence is meaningless and then deciding to give it meaning through self-determined action is an existential theme in literature. It's like "The Myth of Sisyphus" in a way, except Sisyphus can't just run off to ice-fish.
I generally agree with the orthodox position myself on the AI / Satan question as well, but I was playing around with the simulation idea as I brainstormed.
I'll have to finish this tomorrow. Time to sleep.
oh this is good.
Yes, this is a simulation/game. And some of us are incarnated as master gamers or game masters, and some are cheating.
"simulation/game" =/= "predestination".
Consider Conway's "Game of Life" as a simple example. The outcomes of even simple initial configurations become knowable only by running the game.
J, I assume =/= means "does not equal"? "May or may not equal"?
And that's a very good point. Star Wars is not a simulation or game; it's a story.
That said, I think you're making an error Gandalf warns against here, when you talk about 'missing Han Solo for a hundred years' ...
Maybe so. I'm thinking of "my tribe" and not just myself, so it would seem to go back further than me or my parents. And it is not so much responsibility, but improbability.
You point out a number of victories, times when we seem to have hit Can Solo. Very true. At the same time, our victories often seem to be repealing a portion of the enemy's greater victories. Even so, I think you have the better argument on this. We've missed more than we should have, maybe, but certainly not every time.
On fate and free will, I tend to think that fate sets the parameters and we have free will within those parameters. I think that the potential of our free will is meaningful as well; it's not just in petty things but in some larger things, too. And of course we all know that annoying the Presbyterians is one of the fruits of the Spirit.
Oh yeah, then, like you said, Free will within the confines of fate.
Yes, exactly.
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