tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post12220295536591701..comments2024-03-28T16:58:17.705-04:00Comments on Grim's Hall: House opinionatingGrimhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07543082562999855432noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-69201573094475407002012-05-15T03:20:54.572-04:002012-05-15T03:20:54.572-04:00"but the odds that any particular contractor ...<i>"but the odds that any particular contractor can pull it off aren't great."</i><br /><br />Yeah, that's a big part of it right there. If you want to do things not the standard (read 'easy') way, good luck with a lot of contractors. We used to joke about a detail being simple enough, or at least explained clearly enough that a carpenter after a six-pack lunch could still do it- more complex than that and you'd probably have to supervise those things yourself to be sure they're done right.<br /><br />Sounds like what you did is working fine (and Azek and similar products are great for sills and fascias)- and you're right- the factory windows likely kept the water out, the sills just keeping the amount manageable. We were taught that water <i>will</i> get in somewhere- the question was 'how does it get out?' What you don't want is to 'seal' things up 'tight', because you're never as good at sealing as water is at getting in, so your seals are more likely to keep water that intruded in so it can rot things.<br /><br />The brick mold thing was odd to me because I was born and raised here in So Cal, where it's all stick frame construction, dry climate, and bricks are about the last thing you want to use in an active seismic zone. I remember the first time I was in an all brick house- I was ten years old in a suburb of Philadelphia, and I marveled at the nearly foot deep interior window sills, and the coolness of the walls, even in Summertime. The basement was an incredible discovery to me also- we just don't have them here. It was as foreign a concept to me as the wall of humid air that I walked into coming off the plane- what a rude welcome! When you're from a climate where it's humid at 50%, and normal humidity is 20%, sometimes lower, the East and Midwest in the late Summer is an alien climate. Interestingly, that was also the summer I fell in love with my overalls, and wore them almost every day! Must be some relationship there.douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17261739259295914188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-57686658721630537652012-05-13T08:44:36.159-04:002012-05-13T08:44:36.159-04:00"I remember it striking me funny that we were...<i>"I remember it striking me funny that we were supposed to use brick molds for windows in a wood framed house"</i><br /><br />Brick mold is the standard around the windows and a Fronch door at the hovel. All I have to do is keep the hovel caulked and painted. So far, it has kept this old house in pretty fair shape. <i>Far</i> now nudging up against 25 years.<br /><br />I will admit that I'm still dreaming of a poured concrete hacienda designed to resemble a Spanish, red adobe home, tile roof, and whatnot. Of the many items that are open to debate, the drain in the center of the main floor is mandatory. =;^}bthunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15789441349826379510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-71813013611138227272012-05-13T08:05:39.832-04:002012-05-13T08:05:39.832-04:00You're probably right, that my aesthetic prefe...You're probably right, that my aesthetic preference was formed by an older technology that doesn't work as well. On the other hand, if the "This Old House" guys are right, a properly built wooden sill won't leak either. In any case, we used Azek trim to extend the aluminum-clad exterior sills. The other night, we had a dramatic 60-mph storm with sideways rain, and although a lot of water made its way through the front door (normally protected by an 8-foot porch overhang), none came in through any of the windows, not even the exposed ones -- but the waterproofing was achieved by the factory design, not the sill extensions.<br /><br />I agree with you about moisture-proofing: you lick that, and you're prevented most problems. Stucco doesn't work well here. I've never seen anyone control the water properly. I suppose it's possible, but the odds that any particular contractor can pull it off aren't great.Texan99https://www.blogger.com/profile/10479561573903660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-3000949844974402942012-05-13T06:08:01.919-04:002012-05-13T06:08:01.919-04:00I thought about this more today, as I looked at an...I thought about this more today, as I looked at an interesting sheet metal window trim someone had done on a commercial building. Next door was a building with traditional windows, nice deep sills, but not properly done so that they didn't extend past the stucco far enough to leave a proper drip edge. The only reason it didn't have massive problems was that it was located back under a 5' eave. This gets to why the window companies are making what are essentially 'sill-less' windows- they're better. They're far less likely to leak and create water damage problems. How many rotted sills do you see in old houses? Tons. Eliminating that ledge is a good thing from the point of view of defeating water intrusion, and that's the architect and builders bane when it comes to detailing. I'll never forget when I told my Uncle the architect that I was going into architecture, he told me- 'just remember to learn how to detail for moisture control properly, that's the most important thing!'. Okay, so he's a highly pragmatic Chinese- but he's also, in a way, correct. It is the number one cause of lawsuits against builders and architects.<br /><br />With manufactured windows, I would have suggested using brick molds to develop a deeper trim on the window, combined with heavier trims. I think that would get most of what you wanted. I learned this from an architect I used to work for, and I remember it striking me funny that we were supposed to use brick molds for windows in a wood framed house, but now I understand why. Certainly, it's not the way the contractors normally do it.douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17261739259295914188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-32568061539405737802012-05-12T09:42:58.499-04:002012-05-12T09:42:58.499-04:00The difficulty we had was more with the factory-ma...The difficulty we had was more with the factory-made windows than with the depth of the walls. We made the exterior walls six inches deep in order to add rigidity and insulation, but we couldn't seem to find the double-paned windows we wanted in anything but a kind of pre-made sill style that was awfully hard to incorporate into a traditional exterior sill design. The carpenters were really flummoxed, though they did eventually cobble something together for us. We got lots of "not the way we always do it."Texan99https://www.blogger.com/profile/10479561573903660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-57381671637676649312012-05-12T04:11:23.178-04:002012-05-12T04:11:23.178-04:00I was working on a job today, and came across some...I was working on a job today, and came across something that I should suggest to those of you looking to add dimension to your windows- if you need to replace your siding, consider adding a layer of rigid foam sheathing/insulation on the outside of the existing siding, and laying the new siding on top of that- it will add depth to the window frames, and increase your insulation values as a bonus.douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17261739259295914188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-79828634292474790162012-05-10T17:39:10.640-04:002012-05-10T17:39:10.640-04:00Oh, and I have to add, regarding plastics and flat...Oh, and I have to add, regarding plastics and flattened windows- I just wish the manufacturers would start making some products that instead of being plastic mimicing traditional materials, found a way to be plastic in a proud, meaningful way that's true to it's properties. If they did, we'd see more traditional homes done correctly for their type, and modern homes that are true to the nature of a frame and skin construction, instead of a dimensional structural wall with openings- two different animals altogether.douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17261739259295914188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-50966618850934395682012-05-10T17:35:57.556-04:002012-05-10T17:35:57.556-04:00Well, as an architect, let me just say- To each hi...Well, as an architect, let me just say- To each his own. Some of his observations are right own, but as you all have pointed out, many are issues of geography/climate, personal preference, etc. That's part of what keeps us in business. If you just needed a decent enough house, there's not that much point to hiring an architect- standard traditional designs are usually pretty well worked out, in truth. What you need an architect for is accommodating your personal likes and dislikes, and dealing with the complexities that arise with remodels (much tougher to deal with than a new house), tricky local codes, particularly from the planning department (oh, how I envy Houston and it's lack of a zoning code!). Snout houses may not be ideal, but there are many times where there aren't any other options- code required covered parking, lots too narrow for rear or detached garage, etc. Compromise is, unfortunately, part of the game. The trick is doing it well.<br /><br />Relating to the recent discussion of intro vs. extroverts, I think the open plan issue has a lot to do with that. It's how you live in your house that should dictate it's form, not the other way around.douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17261739259295914188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-87039244014602283392012-05-10T11:32:29.797-04:002012-05-10T11:32:29.797-04:00Allow me to revise my greeting in my previous comm...Allow me to revise my greeting in my previous comment to <i>Mornin' <b>Raven</b></i> <br /><br />The nagging urge to proofread my previous post reveals that I had another neural net to digit malfunction. <br /><br />I suppose that I am fortunate in that my current tasks in life, i.e. piddling around the hovel, often with the average power tool, does not require the same fine motor dexterity that I apparently fail to execute in my typing excursions these days.<br /><br />As I've said elsewhere, if you manage to grow old, you'll need a sense of humor.bthunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15789441349826379510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-73653924328929864162012-05-10T10:34:55.992-04:002012-05-10T10:34:55.992-04:00Mornin' Ravin,
"it does get my back up a...Mornin' Ravin,<br /><br /><i>"it does get my back up a bit to hear a geographic place name used to denigrate a swath of good folks."</i><br /><br />Being a Southern, WASP, politically to the right, male boomer, I can certainly appreciate your <i>denigrating a good swath of</i> point.<br /><br />And having lived in a few places north of the Mason Dixon, Jorsey, Mass., NH., north of Chicago, to name a few, I can even say <a href="http://www.virtualrimshot.com/oldsite/media/rimshot1.mp3" rel="nofollow"> some of my best friends are damned Yankees</a>. <br /><br />The South vs North razing is, as Grim and Lewis point out, due to a historical tendency of Northern folk to make too many assumptions about us slow, as in dumb hicks. Then move here and make it their mission to save our culturally bereft carcasses while reminding us of our inferior culture, intellect, etc., etc., etc. <br /><br />So when you hear a Southerner saying <i>low down Yankee</i> or <i>damned Yankee</i>, it is <i>usually</i>, a good natured ribbin' of the prototypical Yankee as viewed from a Southern perspective. Many of us will not say anything if we're really angry, but if we do it will be directed at the individual and not a point on the compass.bthunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15789441349826379510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-64634521952025773152012-05-10T10:22:49.033-04:002012-05-10T10:22:49.033-04:00...He's also very grounded in a specific place...<i>...He's also very grounded in a specific place, (as are others I've seen around here)...</i><br /><br />I think I just finished admitting to that. :)<br /><br />But it's probably true of everyone, really. I just <a href="http://lareviewofbooks.org/article.php?id=606&fulltext=1" rel="nofollow">read a piece in the <i>Los Angeles Review of Books</i></a> on the experience of living after the Rodney King riots, and the influence it had on rap music at the time. <br /><br />I remember that period very well, from the perspective of having been in Atlanta during and after it; but the piece really conveys something I didn't know, which was the change of mood in LA that followed the riots. Apparently the Bloods/Crips peace treaty was a direct result of the riots.<br /><br />Or compare <a href="http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/142723/" rel="nofollow">Roger Simon on gay marriage</a>: "<i>Gay marriage is already virtually a fait accompli. Those of us who live in urban America see it all around us... It is only we geezers who object. (Okay, I don’t.) And, as we know, the minorities. As of now, same-sex marriage is a white man’s game.</i>"<br /><br />I'm sure that's true where he comes from; but it's also true that thirty states have passed constitutional amendments, which generally requires a supermajority vote, expressly to ban the practice. <br /><br />Now, in a sense that's compatible with his claim that "the minorities" object -- non-urban voters, or at least rural voters, could be taken as a kind of non-ethnic minority. Even then, it reinforces your point about grounding.<br /><br />And I think that's fine, as long as we can have a Federalist system of government. It's fine -- even good -- that different areas and different cultures should be able to live side by side. It's only when we try to make everyone live by the same rules that we run into serious friction and culture war.Grimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07543082562999855432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-85156793133462242552012-05-10T10:01:20.690-04:002012-05-10T10:01:20.690-04:00Sippican has a lot of good ideas and what not, but...Sippican has a lot of good ideas and what not, but he does often spoil it with a certain condescending attitude about stuff he doesn't like. <br /><br />He's also very grounded in a specific place, (as are others I've seen around here) and that colors his views. <br /><br />One must know how to filter.Eric Blairnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-54381265188499411132012-05-10T08:46:31.437-04:002012-05-10T08:46:31.437-04:00I don't even have a gripe against Yankees, ser...I don't even have a gripe against Yankees, seriously. I'm 100% kidding. I grew up in Houston in the 60s and 70s, when practically everyone had moved to town from somewhere else for the oil business. I used to have over 100 partners who were New Yorkers. Almost the only time I identify with the South is when I hear nonsense from natives of other regions -- my New York partners had some quaint notions, for instance. When they traveled out to the provinces they were hilarious. I'll always remember one of them poking at his refried beans and asking what the brown stuff was.<br /><br />But really, you just can't plant your vegetables the way those darn Yankees tell you to. They've got it all backwards. You grow your vegetables in the winter and take your break in the height of summer.Texan99https://www.blogger.com/profile/10479561573903660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-20098880016294976732012-05-10T07:37:52.766-04:002012-05-10T07:37:52.766-04:00Actually, the problem with California is that they...Actually, the problem with California is that they move North because of the taxes, prices, etc. and try to enact the same policies that created the situation they left in the first place. The biggest issue is in the tax base support for schools. Oregon doesn't have a sales tax, so most of the local funding comes from property taxes and bonds. Oregon residents understand this and will gladly increase their property taxes minimally to fund schools and whatnot in exchange for not having a sales tax. The Californians that move to Oregon are, in vast numbers, retirees whose children have long graduated high school,, so when bond measures for school budgets come up they vote them down -- afterall, it's not like they have any skin in the game any longer.<br />As to what we call them....well, the most *family* oriented term is "Flatlander".<br />0>;~}DL Slynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-19107517203405869602012-05-09T23:42:09.248-04:002012-05-09T23:42:09.248-04:00For a long time, "Yankee" has mostly mea...For a long time, "Yankee" has mostly meant "folks from somewhere Up North who move down here and then want to tell us ignorant folks how we should run things." If that's what Californians means out West, and it probably is, it's the same thing.<br /><br />But <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0PbJjDhOCE&feature=relmfu" rel="nofollow">try this</a>. It's from 1985, but not too much has changed except that there's a whole lot more of them.Grimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07543082562999855432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-9281782288088457502012-05-09T23:28:21.540-04:002012-05-09T23:28:21.540-04:00Not too many men who are not proud of their family...Not too many men who are not proud of their family. It ain't a northern trait, anymore than homesickness is a southern one.. It's in our DNA to hold our home and family in a special place. <br /> <br /> <br /> I tend to frequent websites that are conservative in nature, maybe it is a chance to feel a bit of refuge away from the ultra liberal place I live-(not yankeeland TM) and it does get my back up a bit to hear a geographic place name used to denigrate a swath of good folks.- especially when it refers to me! It is like folks dissing the French- on their "lack of valor"- like they never heard of Verdun.<br /><br /> Sounds to me you have the same gripe with "Yankees" that westerners have with Californians. Are they "Yankees too? Or has the term "Yankee" become a generic term for "big city leftist" the way "Formica" has come to mean plastic laminate?ravennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-83032377171415126882012-05-09T21:25:40.250-04:002012-05-09T21:25:40.250-04:00Well, and I never met a Yankee who wasn't prou...Well, and I never met a Yankee who wasn't proud. Usually they can barely take a breath from telling us how great it is up North, and how they can't wait until they can make us fix the South up just like it. <br /><br />Which, you know, I always wonder why they were so hot to move. Not that I dislike the North. What I've seen of it is pretty nice; but my home is the southern Appalachians. Anywhere from Georgia to Tennessee to North Carolina feels right to me; if I get up into Virginia, I already feel like I've gotten a bit too far from home. I keep traveling, for one reason or another, but I can always feel the distance from where I belong. <br /><br />I guess that's a Southern trait.Grimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07543082562999855432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-62196585739019613322012-05-09T20:23:32.046-04:002012-05-09T20:23:32.046-04:00Proud to be a Yankee here!
My family has been Yan...Proud to be a Yankee here!<br /> My family has been Yankee's since we landed in 1635, fresh off the" Elizabeth Anne." My ancestors fought Indians, French, and British. One led a rifle Company responding to the alarm at Concord. (did not get there , they received word the battle was over) Bunches fought in the Revolution. <br /> My grandfather was gassed in France, my dad was in the 77th Div.infantry in the pacific, my father in law dug up German mines with the 97 Div. in Europe. My Uncle went down on the Juneau. I had two brothers in Vietnam. We have a long history being honest farmers,loggers,whalers,fishermen and tradesmen. As far as I know, not a professional military man among them. They just did what they had to do. <br /> Not to many crooks or any bankers (but I repeat myself) that I know of, although we did have a first mate who set his captain adrift in the middle of the Pacific....<br /> Yep- proud to be Yankee!ravennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-66205632482247799012012-05-09T18:21:55.281-04:002012-05-09T18:21:55.281-04:00"Sippican is also the genius behind the Borde...<i>"Sippican is also the genius behind the Borderline Sociopathic Blog for Boys. So, you know, he's OK in my book even if he is a low-down Yankee."</i><br /><br />Heh. And that would be a damned Yankee. Ah well, we all have our pluses and minuses, not to mention opinions, etc., etc., etc.<br /><br /><b>P.S.</b> What DL and Tex said about HOA's, ACC's, city/county/community high councils of the acceptable aesthetics, busy-body garden clubs, or facsimiles thereof. <br /><br />My blood, sweat, and tears, my property, forget the dog, beware of owner, no soliciting, trespassers will be violated, and so on.bthunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15789441349826379510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-22339563123493694402012-05-09T18:13:50.060-04:002012-05-09T18:13:50.060-04:00I didn't realize the BSBFB connection. I usua...I didn't realize the BSBFB connection. I usually agree with almost everything he says, Yankee or not. I have to make allowance for Yankees all the time, of course. They're everywhere. But I know better than to listen to a Yankee viewpoint on climate or agriculture, even if I grudgingly admit the worth of their beliefs on other subjects not including the Late Unpleasantness.Texan99https://www.blogger.com/profile/10479561573903660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-91371241758682635012012-05-09T18:06:50.435-04:002012-05-09T18:06:50.435-04:00On the other hand, it's important to point out...On the other hand, it's important to point out that Sippican is also the genius behind the Borderline Sociopathic Blog for Boys. So, you know, he's OK in my book even if he <i>is</i> a low-down Yankee.Grimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07543082562999855432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-11815954159505008802012-05-09T13:09:28.083-04:002012-05-09T13:09:28.083-04:00I'm a fan of waterproof floors that slope to a...I'm a fan of waterproof floors that slope to a center drain, myself, though I don't have any.<br /><br />Our entire ground floor, which is all garage (not the shop variety, the stack-crap-all-over-it variety), is concrete block, because our foundation is only at 17 feet of elevation, and the less wood that makes contact with the ground in this termite-ridden area of the subtropics, the better.<br /><br />It makes sense to put the garage door near the street, but there are ways to prevent the house from ending up like an afterthought. Even a bit of carport or overhang can work wonders, as can a garage door that's something other than a blank face in a flat wall. One's visitors deserve some kind of pedestrian entrance that's not completely overshadowed by the giant mass that holds the family car. If nothing else, the garage can be part of an exterior wall for a compound: something that clearly signals where a visitor is supposed to penetrate in order to move from public to private. On the other hand, I agree with DL: it is emphatically my decision, not that of the architectural control committee. I have no plans ever to live anywhere with either a zoning committee or an HOA.Texan99https://www.blogger.com/profile/10479561573903660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-48089759796259408952012-05-09T12:41:33.945-04:002012-05-09T12:41:33.945-04:00"my next house will be concrete and steel&quo...<i>"my next house will be concrete and steel"</i><br /><br />Amen! And I might add my Energy Saver idea, a main floor sloped towards a center drain making Field Day for policing the barracks just a 15 minute, hose it down from the elevated rain-barrel/cistern, affair!bthunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15789441349826379510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-46872104326412277062012-05-09T12:12:35.891-04:002012-05-09T12:12:35.891-04:00Snount house- There is a good reason for them espe...Snount house- There is a good reason for them especially on narrow city lots- do we really want to do a K turn every time we leave the garage? Although blocking the entire south side of a house with a garage is not a good idea, at least in cold climates. <br /> <br /> 20 odd years in an old single wide trailer in the northwest rain forest- yes I like high ceilings. And big overhangs. Keep the water away! eeekkk!<br /><br /> I suspect, although I dearly hope not, that we are going to find out just exactly what our housing lacks, and how we threw away 8,000 years of house designs in a brief 100 year fling with peace and public safety.<br /> <br /> To whit- bullet proof walls, high fences, heavy doors, and fireproof siding. Those compounds in Afghanistan or variations were<br />standard issue housing design for millennia.<br /><br /> maintenance is a drudge- any material that can be left untended and maintain it's function and appearance is a blessing- life is too short to spent precious week-ends painting, replacing, de-mossing, etc, ad. infinitum- my next house will be concrete and steel. We will save the fancy woodwork for the interior.ravennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5173950.post-27928312140954359852012-05-09T11:52:58.524-04:002012-05-09T11:52:58.524-04:00As Grim points out, ceiling fans are functional. ...As Grim points out, ceiling fans are functional. We have one in every room in our house too.<br /><br />My major dislike of the hovel is a drive-under garage with doors hidden from the street by grading elevation and plantings. Blech! This <i>feature</i> makes me ponder the eternal <i>what was I thinking when I bought this house</i> question. <br /><br />I'm seriously considering building a detached garage/workshop with loft and closing off the garage for a rec-room apartment. Just in case one of the fledglings decides that a return to the nest is necessary. Yeah, yeah, that's the ticket...<br /><br />We also have brick mold trim and window ledges around the exterior of our windows.<br /><br />No plastic, just an old style country type of house, albeit one with indoor plumbing. <br /><br />As for the rest of the list, to each their own, preferred method of the floating of boats, etc., etc., etc.bthunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15789441349826379510noreply@blogger.com